Mad Men

[StarryEyedDreamer]

What a lovely edition, @StarryEyedDreamer! You must be so excited! Are your two editions different?

Very excited!

The first book I posted here with an apple pie picture has pages being yellow more than pink. It is the 1965 revised edition from a seventh printing. But if pages are pink more than yellow, it is the 1953 edition from an eighth printing with a meringue pie picture.

 

[Asa]

 

[SlowUpTake]

Recently watched the episode featuring the Benjamin Speck murders, a particularly nuanced one showing various aspects of morbid fascination. Things that stick with me .... Sally freaking herself out reading the newspaper by flashlight under blankets, Ginsberg's revulsion at the sick jokes being made, Peggy seeming to ignore it emotionally and reveling in shaking down Roger only to have a spasm of guilt over her reflexive concern for the cash in her purse latter that night....And Betty's mother-in-law, such a gem, with her anecdote of being abused by her father as good life lesson ....the underlying misogyny throughout, the episode, (and series) there, and with Peggy identifying with racism, and Joan with her asshole husband.

 

[Asa]

June 2nd was Don's 100th birthday. The fandom celebrates his birthday on June 1st, but in this scene, Megan says, "It's Don's birthday tomorrow." Peggy replied, "It's June first?"

I meant to post this on June first, but oh well.

 

[SlowUpTake]

Watched this episode the other night. Roger is despicable in so many ways but he really glows here.

 

[Asa]

I love that episode. Roger isn't my favorite even if fans adore him, but this is one of my favorite episodes. I like how subtle the topic/plot device is.

 

[aeon]

 

[Asa]

Something I don't get about this show is why they don't show many of the everyday downsides of alcoholism, despite how many of the people in this show are alcoholics. A lot of alcoholics are mean and grumpy, especially when they drink. Alcoholism can also permanently alter your brain, so your personality won't improve if you're dry. There is also a big difference between a dry alcoholic and someone in recovery who is reclaiming who they were prior to the addiction.

You can't convince me that some of these people weren't miserable jerks all the time because they were addicts, or that some of them weren't angry, or even violent, drunks. Duck would have been a great candidate for that because nobody liked him anyway.

Don slowly loses his grip and has a breakdown, in part because of alcohol. That's realistic. I don't think he would be a good candidate for showing off the angry asshole drinker because we're supposed to like him despite his faults. Being a raging jerk would tip the scales too much because he already has so many glaring faults.

A friend who fell off the wagon made a joke at his own expense: "The fastest way to ruin a marriage is through alcoholism." That's some Don Draper truth.

I read/hear a lot about how this show makes people want to drink, and how hard it is to watch if you're new to recovery. I hear the same from people who gave up smoking -- how the show makes them crave a cigarette, and even knowing the grim ending for one character doesn't help.

It's very "high-functioning alcoholic" to write and produce a show that glorifies drinking to that extent without showing us just how messed up alcohol is.

 

[aeon]

But isn’t that almost every show which portrays addictive behavior, especially for those substances and activities which are socially sanctioned?

It is always worse than it is portrayed. So bad, in fact, that the possibility of writing a coherent narrative is a number approaching zero.

Also, shows love to flip-flop on the disease model versus moral choice framework so as to tension-release, and fuel, the drama. I think that is lazy, misrepresentative, and gives weight to things which are significant, and important, but not at all heavy.

In this way, it becomes a kind of pornography, where the spectacle is carefully cultivated, and the machine is easily greased by normative and banal cultural touchpoints.

So destroy yourself, but make it cool, and if you can, sexy, and give it a feel which has that whiff of rebellion, and absolutely hide any discussion of the value—moral, ethical, social, or otherwise—of choice. For that matter, medical and neurological.

Too often there is narrative pathos, when in truth it is pathetic, fluffed-up and glossy.

Alcohol is not just a destroyer of marriages, but families and neighborhoods. It’s far, far uglier and more devastating than it is ever portrayed. But on some level, at least as it concerns the telling, that’s true of all substances and activities that are part of addictive behavior.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[Asa]

But isn’t that almost every show which portrays addictive behavior, especially for those substances and activities which are socially sanctioned?

Correct. I guess Mad Men features such great writing that it made me wonder why the show didn't go there.

It is always worse than it is portrayed. So bad, in fact, that the possibility of writing a coherent narrative is a number approaching zero.

Leaving Las Vegas is an exception. Funny thing is, I don't like that movie.

Even Trainspotting portrayed drugs in a way that made a lot of people want to try drugs.

So destroy yourself, but make it cool, and if you can, sexy, and give it a feel which has that whiff of rebellion, and absolutely hide any discussion of the value—moral, ethical, social, or otherwise—of choice. For that matter, medical and neurological.

Ding, ding, ding. Getting fucked up is cool and, somehow (???) rebellious.
It isn't rebellious at all. It's a key tactic for keeping the masses quiet. Plus, it isn't fringe behavior.



IDK, I see alcoholism being a much bigger issue in the 60s than the show touched on. It was a missed opportunity to get grittier.

 

[SlowUpTake]

being a non drinker, non smoker, non weeder and a former of all three it is shocking how much liquor is consumed in the media. One of the best portrayals on current tv tho is in Furious.

 

[Asa]

being a non drinker, non smoker, non weeder and a former of all three it is shocking how much liquor is consumed in the media. One of the best portrayals on current tv tho is in Furious.

I'm straight-edge, too. This seems to amplify drinking and drug use for me. I notice it in media, too, and I notice the grip it has on society IRL. I've never watched Furious.

 

[aeon]

I watched an analysis video of Mad Men. I thought it was okay, but not worth posting.

It had many clips from the series, and I was surprised by my degree of remembering, for it has been years since I saw it.

It seems I remember the most painful parts. The moments when witness was lacking. The moments when no amount of anything else could hide the unmet need, and when willful disregard left another small.

It made me realize too that my favorite series are the ones where there are no heroes or antiheroes, no villains. No good, or bad, or good or evil. Just people, living lives the best way they know how. Like us. They are flawed, yet noble. Like us.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[Asa]

External success cannot erase inner pain or build real connections. Don is his own enemy.

My two favorite TV shows are Mad Men and Ted Lasso. Neither has a big villain -- a dragon -- to defeat. Most people in both shows are both likeable and flawed to various degrees, though Ted Lasso leans more likeable and MM leans more flawed. Pete and Jamie even seem to follow similar basic arcs. Mad Men lacks a Dani Rojas, which is too bad.

The shows seem like polar opposites, but they are not. Both shows are about how messy it is to be human. They're both about external presentations vs internal conflicts, relationships, human connections, and inner struggles. In Ted Lasso, the external is Ted's positivity, which is similar to Mad Men painting a fake positive ideal via advertising. The main difference is that Ted builds real positivity through his actions, while Don implodes behind his image of perfection.

Ted implodes a little, too, but the two shows have completely different agendas, so he addresses his demons and gets it together faster.

If you go far enough down the road in Mad Men, both shows are about healing, but because healing is a major theme in Lasso, we don't need to wait until the last episode for it. ...Even the episode Sunflowers, where Ted figures things out, parallels a Mad Men pitch. It actually does a better job of explaining moments of profound inspiration than Mad Men, TBH.


Both shows also have great writing.